- SFD-discuss - lists.mailman3.com

Re: [SFD-discuss] Using the Shapado Q&A for "post-SFD" suport

by Frederic Muller - SFI

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/11/2011 10:10 PM, Fabián Rodríguez wrote: >> So no Shapado right now obviously, but working out a nice Q&A >>> section will be added on the todos. > I see some contradiction in the above, but I also see your point. > To be clear, I don't think declaring any such resources as > official in any way is important or critical here, but bringing > attention to local organizers so they decide if this fits their > context is important if we want to increase such tools visibility > and success (or not!). Maybe I misunderstood your message then: I thought it was a recommendation for SFD.org to use. Note also that I interpreted Q&A as FAQ in both your initial message and my reply. Hope that clarifies everything now :) Fred -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk5s1FgACgkQoKznslZ0d263lwCeJ+b+ng1uhIpk+HhVcCW4S9qf Y8wAn1wmQdug1aIN3lKDfaidv1URgl9G =tLb8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Sept. 11, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] JoinDiaspora and other SaaS alternatives

by Julian H. Stacey

> other social networks that have reached or target being FaiF are out buzzword fails. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=FaiF&go=Go Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Reply below, not above; Indent with "> "; Cumulative like a play script. Format: Plain text. Not HTML, multipart/alternative, base64, quoted-printable. http://www.softwarefreedomday.org 17th Sept, http://berklix.org/sfd/ Oct.

Sept. 11, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] JoinDiaspora and other SaaS alternatives

by Julian H. Stacey

=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Fabi=E1n_Rodr=EDguez?= wrote: > On 09/10/2011 11:54 AM, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > SAAS & clouds are not the direction UK government is going eg tax > > office & companies house (co. reg. authority) are pushing processing > > on to applicants PCs (Processing of PDF v. 1.7 editable forms for tax > > returns by Adobe Reader etc), Central servers are just for upload on > > completion, Not remote SAAS processing. > > Hmmm local examples are even more interesting. I don't quite see the > argument against SaaS on remote servers here, though. I mean: SAAS is _Service_), & Service (& servers) costs serious money. CDROMs & free software can undercut & compete. - One either pays money for service, - Or one gets advertised at to pay for the service, - Or one gets to be harvested in case of some "social" web sites, - Or in case of government, presumably to keep cost down, British tax office for corporation tax & companies house registration are having processing done on users PCs, & they're just providing lots of static web pages & up & down load, but avoiding bulk forms data input processing direct on line (full scale SAAS Service would cost more). Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Reply below, not above; Indent with "> "; Cumulative like a play script. Format: Plain text. Not HTML, multipart/alternative, base64, quoted-printable. http://www.softwarefreedomday.org 17th Sept, http://berklix.org/sfd/ Oct.

Sept. 11, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] Using the Shapado Q&A for "post-SFD" suport

by Fabián Rodríguez

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/10/2011 12:20 PM, Frederic Muller - SFI wrote: > > On 09/10/2011 07:08 PM, Fabián Rodríguez wrote: [...] > Likewise I am not a big fan of hosting my data in someone else home Me neither - but I lack the time to become autonomous on every single service I come across before I even try it. The data at this particular instance of Shapado (floss.shapado.com) is so little I only view it as a starting point, but SFI could decide to host another instance for its own audience. What I am saying is there is this resource already there, we can use it now, and if we like it, adopt it / transfer it / re-start it elsewhere. We can choose either way. > and should we run something similar on SFD servers that will have to > go through integration with existing services as much as possible, > and familiarity from the admins. I can't help in this part (timewise and admin-wise), but surely other Shapado admins (such as Debian's) have gone through that and can share experience. > So no Shapado right now obviously, but working out a nice Q&A > section will be added on the todos. I see some contradiction in the above, but I also see your point. To be clear, I don't think declaring any such resources as official in any way is important or critical here, but bringing attention to local organizers so they decide if this fits their context is important if we want to increase such tools visibility and success (or not!). Cheers, Fabian Rodriguez Montreal, QC, Canada http://libreplanet.org/wiki/User:MagicFab ~ http://wiki.softwarefreedomday.org/2011/Canada/Montreal -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: PGP/Mime available upon request Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk5swT4ACgkQfUcTXFrypNV0IQCgoDGJ0t+NBQ3mT7k4Xv6GMsrF t/EAoK95ZV+BOJGM3oXwjV5/eM4VmcGb =OGyP -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Sept. 11, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] JoinDiaspora and other SaaS alternatives

by Fabián Rodríguez

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/10/2011 11:54 AM, Julian H. Stacey wrote: >>> another tools for SaaS discussion on SFD should you come across >>> such > > No idea what SaaS was. I looked it up. > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SaaS "Software as a service" Just > another marketing buzzword: "The concept of SaaS has been popularized > by Salesforce.com, which coined the term "The End of Software" to > differentiate its (then new) software-as-a-service approach .... Yawn > ! ...and an important one. Much like "Cloud Computing", I get questions phrased using such vocabulary all the time. Sorry I dropped it too fast here, anyone interested can read further on SaaS, for example articles like this: http://autonomo.us/2010/03/richard-stallman-on-saas/ I don't necessarily need or want everyone to agree on everything there, but I think it's important to remain critical while welcoming questions and discussions around some of the technical/ethical issues such tools may introduce. Different people reach different levels of readiness regarding setting their own services and ultimately being 100% free and autonomous. Just going through such an exercise regarding email, webmail and web hosting is a rare exercise. > Amusing bit: "Data escrow .... 85 percent of the participants wanted > to take a copy of their SaaS data. A third of these participants > wanted a copy on a daily basis." > > People askng about SAAS & clouds could be told: Remote data & service > clouds can evaporate. They seldom do, but when they do... a notable example is Geocities, Can anyone cite others ? > A free app. or server one installs localy from eg an SFD CDROM/DVD, > is an app. & data a remote admin on a remote SAAS server + cloud > can't break for you by unexpected upgrade, service removal, > bankruptcy, net outage, or deciding to go commercial & charge for > next week. I'd be careful there. Service removal can happen at many levels and in fact one of the arguments for using SaaS is lower cost of redundancy, higher availability, etc. -> again, not saying this is absolute truth, just one of the counter-arguments. > SAAS & clouds are not the direction UK government is going eg tax > office & companies house (co. reg. authority) are pushing processing > on to applicants PCs (Processing of PDF v. 1.7 editable forms for tax > returns by Adobe Reader etc), Central servers are just for upload on > completion, Not remote SAAS processing. Hmmm local examples are even more interesting. I don't quite see the argument against SaaS on remote servers here, though. Regarding Michael's remarks: On 09/11/2011 05:09 AM, Michael Dorrington wrote: [...] > (At least :) Two things concern me about Diaspora: > > 1. The ability of the project to write secure code. Writing secure > code is essential for a project of this kind. > http://www.kalzumeus.com/2010/09/22/security-lessons-learned-from-the-diasp… Given > the context and the nature of the project, and its current status (not even beta), I don't see a problem there. In fact it's interesting anyone else would actually care about it enough to check the code, blog about it, and explain what failed and can be improved there. I see a path and a goal, and people learning. I am deeply annoyed the devs use Apple systems, for example - how credible can their platform be if they don't even dogfood on FaiF ? Or why do they keep posting videos in YouTube only ? Some of us using their site raise such concerns, and there is room for that too. I also see an opportunity to learn more about the difficulties and current failures. Even if Diaspora fails spectacularly as a finished project/product, many lessons are there for the taking. > 2. The contributor agreement. > http://www.vedetta.com/a-few-notes-on-diaspora-the-diaspora-verdict > The agreement itself is on Google Docs and requires a login to view > it. FaiF? Have you requested for it to be published elsewhere ? You know, that article has excellent information on many things needed for a project to be truly FaiF which would probably scare away anyone not willing to go through all the probems found. The main point I tend to focus on and amplify and I feel applies to many situations where we try to get people to use free technology and content, is "The current Diaspora flaws are fixable." Will they fix them ? Will people join to fix them or just sit around ? Is it worth our attention (or can we afford not to try and know this project) ? Again, I don't particularly embrace 200% or agree with everyone and everything about Diaspora, but not looking under its surface as a free software advocate seems like a lost opportunity on many levels. I'm also not using this as my sole "channel" to share stuff, so if any other social networks that have reached or target being FaiF are out there, I'll glaldy add them to my tools :) Cheers, Fabian Rodriguez Montreal, QC, Canada http://libreplanet.org/wiki/User:MagicFab ~ http://wiki.softwarefreedomday.org/2011/Canada/Montreal -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: PGP/Mime available upon request Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk5su/EACgkQfUcTXFrypNUFqwCeMbd0E0SuxuUycp4xlO+xGnCg kjoAniv4Ap2nz4wj5s0a0M+CEz87iC5m =YUpl -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Sept. 11, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] JoinDiaspora and other SaaS alternatives

by Michael Dorrington

On 10/09/11 12:13, Fabián Rodríguez wrote: > Hi everyone > > If you are on Diaspora's main pod (at joindiaspora.com) please consider > adding me to your aspects -> magicfab(a)joindiaspora.com > > If you are not but would like to be, please email me offlist with your > preferred email address and I can send you an invite. To find out more > about Diaspora, see: > https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Diaspora This refers to the software (but there isn't much on it): https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Diaspora_%28software%29 (At least :) Two things concern me about Diaspora: 1. The ability of the project to write secure code. Writing secure code is essential for a project of this kind. http://www.kalzumeus.com/2010/09/22/security-lessons-learned-from-the-diasp… 2. The contributor agreement. http://www.vedetta.com/a-few-notes-on-diaspora-the-diaspora-verdict The agreement itself is on Google Docs and requires a login to view it. FaiF? Mike.

Sept. 11, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] Using the Shapado Q&A for "post-SFD" suport

by Frederic Muller - SFI

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/10/2011 07:08 PM, Fabián Rodríguez wrote: > Hi everyone > > As many of you, ** after Sept. 17 ** I anticipate the questions and > requests for help from people that will discover free software or > will become more curious about it with this event. I think that's a great point and we should definitely keep a section for visitors ending up on sfd website and looking for more information between each celebration (or as a direct follow up of SFD). > > I'd like to propose we show participants how to use Shapado FLOSS, > a Q&A site where questions can be asked in most any language, > while providing a reputation/score system for questions and > answers: http://floss.shapado.com/ > > This is powered by Shapado, and hasn't seen much exposure/use yet, > but works well. Other FLOSS projects have adopted the same engine, > creating microsites which share authentication and resources: > http://ask.debian.net/ (official) http://owncloud.shapado.com/ > (official) http://libreoffice.shapado.com/ (unofficial) > http://ubuntu.shapado.com/ (unofficial) Looks very much like a discussion forum to me (with voting, though voting seems to only be handled as a tag and not to push stuff up by default). A Q&A section should on the contrary not be a discussion area but a carefully planned answer list to what people may or may not be thinking about. Any missing question should then be asked through our normal communication channels. As I have been saying in the past I don't think mailing lists (or GMANE) are well suited for people wanting to ask a one time question (one may argue that Google probably is... ;-) ) or for people who simply do not like mailing lists. > .. > > And the list goes on. > > For general FLOSS questions, including Mac/Windows related ones, I > find this may be an excellent way to provide post-SFD support and > assistance to the people we will meet. It provides several > advantages over forums and newsgroups, while presenting a > multilingual web interface that is easier to use and builds > FAQ-like knowledge over time. > > Shapado has an IRC channel if anyone here has questions (#shapado > on Freenode) and of course dogfoods its own Q&A at Shapado.com. If > anyone wants to help with the admin/graphic design or moderation > of the FLOSS microsite, please come by IRC and ask around. I have > no other connection with the project than being an avid user and > moderator / creator of some of the links mentioned above. > > Let me know what you think, I will be adding a sheet of "essential > FLOSS local links" to our promo material and it will include > http://floss.shapado.com/. Likewise I am not a big fan of hosting my data in someone else home and should we run something similar on SFD servers that will have to go through integration with existing services as much as possible, and familiarity from the admins. So no Shapado right now obviously, but working out a nice Q&A section will be added on the todos. Thanks a lot. Fred > > Cheers, > > Fabian Rodriguez Montral, QC, Canada > http://libreplanet.org/wiki/User:MagicFab ~ > http://wiki.softwarefreedomday.org/2011/Canada/Montreal > > > > _______________________________________________ SFD-discuss > mailing list SFD-discuss(a)sf-day.org > http://mail.sf-day.org/lists/listinfo/sfd-discuss > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk5rj0EACgkQoKznslZ0d243nQCfYTNX5+124N6nc3d+4mGQzOG7 S4EAnjVgQ4UEHAzM5qfWutAhcAaEANpn =InLV -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Sept. 10, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] Using the Shapado Q&A for "post-SFD" suport

by Frederic Muller - SFI

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/10/2011 07:08 PM, Fabián Rodríguez wrote: > Hi everyone > > As many of you, ** after Sept. 17 ** I anticipate the questions > and requests for help from people that will discover free software > or will become more curious about it with this event. I think that's a great point and we should in fact keep a section for visitors ending up on sfd website and looking for more information between each celebration. > > I'd like to propose we show participants how to use Shapado FLOSS, > a Q&A site where questions can be asked in most any language, while > providing a reputation/score system for questions and answers: > http://floss.shapado.com/ > > This is powered by Shapado, and hasn't seen much exposure/use yet, > but works well. Other FLOSS projects have adopted the same engine, > creating microsites which share authentication and resources: > http://ask.debian.net/ (official) http://owncloud.shapado.com/ > (official) http://libreoffice.shapado.com/ (unofficial) > http://ubuntu.shapado.com/ (unofficial) Looks very much like a forum discussion to me (with voting, though voting seems to only be handled as a tag and not to push stuff up by default). Q&A section should on the contrary not be a discussion but a carefully planned answer list to what people may or may not wonder about. Anything else should then be asked through our normal communication channels. As I have been saying in the past I don't think mailing lists (or GMANE) are well suited for people wanting to ask a one time question (one may argue that Google probably is... ;-) ) or for people who simply do not like mailing lists. > .. > > And the list goes on. > > For general FLOSS questions, including Mac/Windows related ones, I > find this may be an excellent way to provide post-SFD support and > assistance to the people we will meet. It provides several > advantages over forums and newsgroups, while presenting a > multilingual web interface that is easier to use and builds > FAQ-like knowledge over time. > > Shapado has an IRC channel if anyone here has questions (#shapado > on Freenode) and of course dogfoods its own Q&A at Shapado.com. If > anyone wants to help with the admin/graphic design or moderation of > the FLOSS microsite, please come by IRC and ask around. I have no > other connection with the project than being an avid user and > moderator / creator of some of the links mentioned above. > > Let me know what you think, I will be adding a sheet of "essential > FLOSS local links" to our promo material and it will include > http://floss.shapado.com/. Likewise I am not a big fan of hosting my data in someone else home and should we run something similar on SFD servers that will have to go through integration with existing services as much as possible, and familiarity from the admins. So no Shapado right now obviously, but working out a nice Q&A section will be added on the todos. Thanks a lot. Fred > > Cheers, > > Fabian Rodriguez Montral, QC, Canada > http://libreplanet.org/wiki/User:MagicFab ~ > http://wiki.softwarefreedomday.org/2011/Canada/Montreal > > > > _______________________________________________ SFD-discuss mailing > list SFD-discuss(a)sf-day.org > http://mail.sf-day.org/lists/listinfo/sfd-discuss > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk5rjisACgkQoKznslZ0d24NPACfZ9Fk9NcLvimM0eBHi0k3ceGl SyMAoIG939mUeEssWRsYzHszg5BJpYwT =4Kgx -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Sept. 10, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] New OpenDisc release for SFD

by Fabián Rodríguez

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/09/2011 10:00 AM, Marcelo Araldi wrote: > I vote for LibreOffice :) > > *Marcelo Araldi me encontre na web! > <http://about.me/marceloaraldi>** * > > > > 2011/9/9 Jiří Navrátil <jiri(a)navratil.cz <mailto:jiri@navratil.cz>> > > Phil, > > Could you let me know, which non-free games I have to remove from > SFD2011OpenDisc.iso ? (preferable filenames on DVD) > > Fred, > > shall I remove openoffice and add libreoffice from OpenDisc.11.09.iso > ? > This made me think, if anyone wants to distribute a separate LibreOffice DVD here is how I put together a local version for Quebec: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/User:MagicFab/LibODVD Cheers, Fabian Rodriguez Montral, QC, Canada http://libreplanet.org/wiki/User:MagicFab ~ http://wiki.softwarefreedomday.org/2011/Canada/Montreal -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: PGP/Mime available upon request Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk5riEMACgkQfUcTXFrypNXXGgCeNVu0/2+hixFUjW5/vUJX9+rr SyAAoKq2aZwiKM8k5vnlU7xyJ1EbArK8 =lwEu -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Sept. 10, 2011

Re: [SFD-discuss] JoinDiaspora and other SaaS alternatives

by Julian H. Stacey

> > another tools for SaaS discussion on SFD should you come across such No idea what SaaS was. I looked it up. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SaaS "Software as a service" Just another marketing buzzword: "The concept of SaaS has been popularized by Salesforce.com, which coined the term "The End of Software" to differentiate its (then new) software-as-a-service approach .... Yawn ! Amusing bit: "Data escrow .... 85 percent of the participants wanted to take a copy of their SaaS data. A third of these participants wanted a copy on a daily basis." People askng about SAAS & clouds could be told: Remote data & service clouds can evaporate. A free app. or server one installs localy from eg an SFD CDROM/DVD, is an app. & data a remote admin on a remote SAAS server + cloud can't break for you by unexpected upgrade, service removal, bankruptcy, net outage, or deciding to go commercial & charge for next week. SAAS & clouds are not the direction UK government is going eg tax office & companies house (co. reg. authority) are pushing processing on to applicants PCs (Processing of PDF v. 1.7 editable forms for tax returns by Adobe Reader etc), Central servers are just for upload on completion, Not remote SAAS processing. Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Reply below, not above; Indent with "> "; Cumulative like a play script. Format: Plain text. Not HTML, multipart/alternative, base64, quoted-printable. http://www.softwarefreedomday.org 17th Sept, http://berklix.org/sfd/ Oct.

Sept. 10, 2011