September 2011 - Dillo-dev - lists.mailman3.com

how to open links etc

by waltdnes＠waltdnes.org

On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 07:34:33PM -0800, Roger wrote > >Easy solution: ask the user whether to open the file, or just save it to > >disk. > > So, the prompt saves my butt 5% of the time, the other 95% of the time I'm > harassed by a prompt like in Windows. > > IMO, configuring for the fewest clicks possible is best. And like > you said, provide a file with an option to to link in external apps if > the user so wishes. (ie mutt's $HOME/.mutt/mailcap is a good example) > > Keeping a file type pointing to null or commented, gets default > (download) action? Can we have 3 options? 1) The "out-of-the-box" default is to ask what to do 2) Save to disk 3) Specify a helper application. Allow to specify parameters as required. And for number 3; puhleeeese don't "pull a Firefox" by de-referencing symlinks. For instance... $ ll /usr/bin/abiword lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 11 Sep 3 02:53 /usr/bin/abiword -> abiword-2.8 When you tell Firefox to use abiword for *.doc files, it de-references the symlink and uses /usr/bin/abiword-2.8. So a few weeks from now, an update upgrades me to abiword-2.9 and Firefox whines about not being able to find /usr/bin/abiword-2.8 when I click on a link to a *.doc file. See also https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=176486 Warning, some strong language from annoyed users. See especially comments 46, 47, and 48. -- Walter Dnes <waltdnes at waltdnes.org>

Sept. 18, 2011

how to open links etc

by itsme_410＠yahoo.com

--- On Thu, 9/15/11, Benjamin Johnson <obeythepenguin at gmail.com> wrote: > From: Benjamin Johnson <obeythepenguin at gmail.com> > Subject: Re: [Dillo-dev] how to open links etc > To: dillo-dev at dillo.org > Date: Thursday, September 15, 2011, 1:21 PM > On Wed, 14 Sep 2011 23:34:33 -0400, > Roger <rogerx.oss at gmail.com> > wrote: > > >> On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 08:16:43PM -0400, Benjamin > Johnson wrote: > > > >> Easy solution: ask the user whether to open the > file, or just save it to > >> disk. > > > > So, the prompt saves my butt 5% of the time, the other > 95% of the time I'm > > harassed by a prompt like in Windows. > > > > IMO, configuring for the fewest clicks possible is > best.? And like you said, > > provide a file with an option to to link in external > apps if the user so > > wishes.? (ie mutt's $HOME/.mutt/mailcap is a good > example) > > > > Keeping a file type pointing to null or commented, > gets default (download) > > action? > > > > I didn't want to say much more without being able to > help code it, but I don't > > want to see another prompt popping-up. (ie. Dillo quit > prompt) :-/ > > Then add a "Remember this choice" option so it won't prompt > you again. > > I disagree that all prompts are automatically bad.? > After a while they do get annoying (and there should be some > way to disable them), but for new users the verbosity can be > helpful.? More importantly, it avoids surprising the > user when the program doesn't behave as expected -- it opens > instead of downloads, or vice-versa -- and of course, > different users will have different expectations for which > behavior is "correct." > > (In my own software, I always err on the side of verbosity, > no matter how annoying it is to me personally -- because as > the developer, I know how to disable it on my own machine!) > > ~Benjamin > > _______________________________________________ > Dillo-dev mailing list > Dillo-dev at dillo.org > http://lists.auriga.wearlab.de/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dillo-dev Is it possible to consider providing the option on how to open links, etc.....i don't mind having it in some preferences file....i understand it may be some work, but this would certainly be very useful to have....? thanks very much!!

Sept. 18, 2011

Close dillo with multiple tabs open

by itsme_410＠yahoo.com

--- On Sat, 9/17/11, Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid at dillo.org> wrote: > From: Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid at dillo.org> > Subject: Re: [Dillo-dev] Close dillo with multiple tabs open > To: dillo-dev at dillo.org > Date: Saturday, September 17, 2011, 3:56 PM > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 09:19:42AM > -0700, Globe Trotter wrote: > > > > > > --- On Sat, 9/17/11, Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid at dillo.org> > wrote: > > > > > From: Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid at dillo.org> > > > Subject: Re: [Dillo-dev] Close dillo with > multiple tabs open > > > To: dillo-dev at dillo.org > > > Date: Saturday, September 17, 2011, 12:09 PM > > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 11:20:29AM > > > +0200, Johannes Hofmann wrote: > > > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 05:04:49AM +0000, > corvid > > > wrote: > > > > > Roger wrote: > > > > > > >> > you mean, "confirm > to exit > > > prompt".? Ditto.? Rarely, if ever accidentally > > > quit. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> I wasn't sure what my > opinion was > > > on this at first, but now I think an > > > > > > >> option sounds > reasonable. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Why not, if there is demand > for it and > > > the default is safe > > > > > > >(i.e.? off). > > > > > > > > > > > > Ditto. I've never accidentally > quit. > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh, I've used File > Quit once > in a > > > while, but with that many key sequences or > > > > > > clicks, it's tough to > accidentally > > > quit.? Also, few options under the File > > > > > > menu.? Most times, I just halt > -p. > > > > > > > > > > Just occurred to me that everyone's > been saying > > > that they don't need this > > > > > dialog box. I checked firefox and it > doesn't warn > > > when quitting. Maybe we > > > > > don't need it at all. > > > > > > > > Safari has it and given the fact that we > only recently > > > switched from > > > > Ctrl-Q to Crtl-W for closing tabs, people > might > > > accidentally hit > > > > Ctrl-Q when they want to close just the tab. > It > > > happend to me at > > > > least. So for now I would keep it. > > > > > > ? Same for me. > > > > > > ? Now, if somebody wants to add a preference for > that, > > > could be, > > > but the default should be to ask. > > > > I see no harm in this: put in a default but make it > configurable. > >? While I don't have the urge to use ctrl-q much, > I am still stumped why alt-q > >? does? not work now to close dillo, as I had > conditioned myself to. i usually > > immediately rebound and go with the new action.... > > ? ctrl-q is considered more used across apps. (that > made it the default) > > ? You can set alt-q in keysrc if you want. Thanks, i was not complaining, just saying that my mind had become conditioned to using alt-q when exiting dillo (only)....

Sept. 18, 2011

Close dillo with multiple tabs open

by obeythepenguin＠gmail.com

On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 17:08:52 -0400, Roger <rogerx.oss at gmail.com> wrote: > However, how would you like a prompt on your vehicle every time you > pressed the > brakes? Do you really want to stop? Or, how about every time you start > your > vehicle and you're within an emergency situation and get, "Do you really > want > to start your car?" With real world applications, security of preventing > accidental quitting is application response to users intentions. I don't know much about cars, but I do know it's pretty hard to accidentally start one. And computers are, in terms of physical interactions, much more difficult to use than most real-world objects (and less predictable, as well). That's why usability is so tricky to get right, and why most programs' interfaces tend to follow established standards and conventions. By the way, it's worth noting that vim prompts you to prevent accidental quitting, BSD vi prompts you to prevent accidental quitting, even freaking *ed* prompts you to prevent accidental quitting. I find it pretty annoying sometimes, too, but there have been many times when that prompt has saved me from far greater frustration. ~Benjamin

Sept. 17, 2011

Close dillo with multiple tabs open

by rogerx.oss＠gmail.com

>Safari has it and given the fact that we only recently switched from >Ctrl-Q to Crtl-W for closing tabs, people might accidentally hit >Ctrl-Q when they want to close just the tab. It happend to me at >least. So for now I would keep it. Elinks uses CTRL-C to close tabs. It's kind of tough to think CTRL-Q closes a tab to begin with. Mistake for "close qab" just doesn't sound right to begin with. However, if CTRL-C was mapped to quit, aka "close application", well that would be confusing. Or if "CTRL-Q" were on a keyboard layout next to the "CTRL-C" But still, ELinks does ask to quit before quiting. But this is because I keep typing ":q" (VIM quit), and 'q' is mapped to quit in ELinks. (But this is user error, as I start thinking I'm within VIM at times due to all the console text.) So, some good examples when there's no conflict, and some examples where there is a conflict. Really, when asking, you're just trying to prevent user error. However, how would you like a prompt on your vehicle every time you pressed the brakes? Do you really want to stop? Or, how about every time you start your vehicle and you're within an emergency situation and get, "Do you really want to start your car?" With real world applications, security of preventing accidental quitting is application response to users intentions. <shrugs> I'm sure this has been debated quite a bit, and with Windows, I get so many prompts that I become non-productive & frustrated. -- Roger http://rogerx.freeshell.org/

Sept. 17, 2011

Close dillo with multiple tabs open

by jcid＠dillo.org

On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 09:19:42AM -0700, Globe Trotter wrote: > > > --- On Sat, 9/17/11, Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid at dillo.org> wrote: > > > From: Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid at dillo.org> > > Subject: Re: [Dillo-dev] Close dillo with multiple tabs open > > To: dillo-dev at dillo.org > > Date: Saturday, September 17, 2011, 12:09 PM > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 11:20:29AM > > +0200, Johannes Hofmann wrote: > > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 05:04:49AM +0000, corvid > > wrote: > > > > Roger wrote: > > > > > >> > you mean, "confirm to exit > > prompt".? Ditto.? Rarely, if ever accidentally > > quit. > > > > > >> > > > > > >> I wasn't sure what my opinion was > > on this at first, but now I think an > > > > > >> option sounds reasonable. > > > > > > > > > > > >Why not, if there is demand for it and > > the default is safe > > > > > >(i.e.? off). > > > > > > > > > > Ditto. I've never accidentally quit. > > > > > > > > > > Oh, I've used File > Quit once in a > > while, but with that many key sequences or > > > > > clicks, it's tough to accidentally > > quit.? Also, few options under the File > > > > > menu.? Most times, I just halt -p. > > > > > > > > Just occurred to me that everyone's been saying > > that they don't need this > > > > dialog box. I checked firefox and it doesn't warn > > when quitting. Maybe we > > > > don't need it at all. > > > > > > Safari has it and given the fact that we only recently > > switched from > > > Ctrl-Q to Crtl-W for closing tabs, people might > > accidentally hit > > > Ctrl-Q when they want to close just the tab. It > > happend to me at > > > least. So for now I would keep it. > > > > ? Same for me. > > > > ? Now, if somebody wants to add a preference for that, > > could be, > > but the default should be to ask. > > I see no harm in this: put in a default but make it configurable. > While I don't have the urge to use ctrl-q much, I am still stumped why alt-q > does not work now to close dillo, as I had conditioned myself to. i usually > immediately rebound and go with the new action.... ctrl-q is considered more used across apps. (that made it the default) You can set alt-q in keysrc if you want. -- Cheers Jorge.-

Sept. 17, 2011

Close dillo with multiple tabs open

by obeythepenguin＠gmail.com

On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 12:45:29 -0400, Rogut?s Sparnuotos <rogutes at googlemail.com> wrote: > Benjamin Johnson (2011-09-17 10:14): >> Speaking of restoring sessions, one of my own users had the very >> clever idea to implement that feature using bookmarks -- save all >> the open tabs in a certain bookmarks section, then load all the >> bookmarks in that section on startup. I haven't coded it yet, but I >> wanted to share since it was such a neat solution to that problem. > > I guess this would be much better than nothing, and separate sessions > could use separate bookmark sections (controlled by a command line > parameter or dialogs)... Though one gets spoiled by the ones like > Firefox, > that take the pain of restoring POST data, this approach is not > bulletproof and perhaps for dillo it would suffice to restore a simple > URL > list into tabs. I should note that this suggestion was for Dillo-Win32, which has the bookmarks code built into the browser (and already supports loading an entire bookmarks section in tabs). So it's quite practical there, since it's just reusing existing code. I doubt the bookmarks approach would work as well in mainline, since it would have to run everything through the DPI, and that code's already complicated enough as it is. But at least the DPI can easily be modified to store bookmarks in a database, for the rare user who has a running MySQL server but lacks the CPU power for Firefox. ;-) ~Benjamin

Sept. 17, 2011

Close dillo with multiple tabs open

by rogutes＠googlemail.com

Benjamin Johnson (2011-09-17 10:14): > On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 01:04:49 -0400, corvid <corvid at lavabit.com> wrote: > > >Just occurred to me that everyone's been saying that they don't need this > >dialog box. I checked firefox and it doesn't warn when quitting. Maybe we > >don't need it at all. > > Of course, Firefox has the ability to restore the last open session > when it starts up; accidentally quitting isn't so bad when you can > just restart and resume where you left off. (Out of curiosity, does > it do that by default?) I think Firefox asks how it should behave regarding sessions when quiting for the first time. > Speaking of restoring sessions, one of my own users had the very > clever idea to implement that feature using bookmarks -- save all > the open tabs in a certain bookmarks section, then load all the > bookmarks in that section on startup. I haven't coded it yet, but I > wanted to share since it was such a neat solution to that problem. I guess this would be much better than nothing, and separate sessions could use separate bookmark sections (controlled by a command line parameter or dialogs)... Though one gets spoiled by the ones like Firefox, that take the pain of restoring POST data, this approach is not bulletproof and perhaps for dillo it would suffice to restore a simple URL list into tabs. -- -- Rogut?s Sparnuotos

Sept. 17, 2011

Close dillo with multiple tabs open

by itsme_410＠yahoo.com

--- On Sat, 9/17/11, Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid at dillo.org> wrote: > From: Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid at dillo.org> > Subject: Re: [Dillo-dev] Close dillo with multiple tabs open > To: dillo-dev at dillo.org > Date: Saturday, September 17, 2011, 12:09 PM > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 11:20:29AM > +0200, Johannes Hofmann wrote: > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 05:04:49AM +0000, corvid > wrote: > > > Roger wrote: > > > > >> > you mean, "confirm to exit > prompt".? Ditto.? Rarely, if ever accidentally > quit. > > > > >> > > > > >> I wasn't sure what my opinion was > on this at first, but now I think an > > > > >> option sounds reasonable. > > > > > > > > > >Why not, if there is demand for it and > the default is safe > > > > >(i.e.? off). > > > > > > > > Ditto. I've never accidentally quit. > > > > > > > > Oh, I've used File > Quit once in a > while, but with that many key sequences or > > > > clicks, it's tough to accidentally > quit.? Also, few options under the File > > > > menu.? Most times, I just halt -p. > > > > > > Just occurred to me that everyone's been saying > that they don't need this > > > dialog box. I checked firefox and it doesn't warn > when quitting. Maybe we > > > don't need it at all. > > > > Safari has it and given the fact that we only recently > switched from > > Ctrl-Q to Crtl-W for closing tabs, people might > accidentally hit > > Ctrl-Q when they want to close just the tab. It > happend to me at > > least. So for now I would keep it. > > ? Same for me. > > ? Now, if somebody wants to add a preference for that, > could be, > but the default should be to ask. I see no harm in this: put in a default but make it configurable. While I don't have the urge to use ctrl-q much, I am still stumped why alt-q does not work now to close dillo, as I had conditioned myself to. i usually immediately rebound and go with the new action....

Sept. 17, 2011

Close dillo with multiple tabs open

by jcid＠dillo.org

On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 11:20:29AM +0200, Johannes Hofmann wrote: > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 05:04:49AM +0000, corvid wrote: > > Roger wrote: > > > >> > you mean, "confirm to exit prompt". Ditto. Rarely, if ever accidentally quit. > > > >> > > > >> I wasn't sure what my opinion was on this at first, but now I think an > > > >> option sounds reasonable. > > > > > > > >Why not, if there is demand for it and the default is safe > > > >(i.e. off). > > > > > > Ditto. I've never accidentally quit. > > > > > > Oh, I've used File > Quit once in a while, but with that many key sequences or > > > clicks, it's tough to accidentally quit. Also, few options under the File > > > menu. Most times, I just halt -p. > > > > Just occurred to me that everyone's been saying that they don't need this > > dialog box. I checked firefox and it doesn't warn when quitting. Maybe we > > don't need it at all. > > Safari has it and given the fact that we only recently switched from > Ctrl-Q to Crtl-W for closing tabs, people might accidentally hit > Ctrl-Q when they want to close just the tab. It happend to me at > least. So for now I would keep it. Same for me. Now, if somebody wants to add a preference for that, could be, but the default should be to ask. -- Cheers Jorge.-

Sept. 17, 2011