March 2006 - Dillo-dev - lists.mailman3.com

Re: [Dillo-dev] [mike@easysw.com: Re: FLTK2-based Dillo for Debian installer]

by Jorge Arellano Cid

On Tue, Mar 21, 2006 at 06:19:56PM +0100, Attilio Fiandrotti wrote: > > <snip> > > >Jorge Arellano Cid wrote: > > > >>Hi Michael, > >> > >> I just received this request in our mailing list. The keypoint > >>is how near/far is FLTK2 from having DirectFB rendering support. > >>If some Debian developers help with the task, what's your > >>estimation? > > > > > >No work has been done. > > > >That said, I believe Cairo offers DirectFB support, and FLTK 2 can > >use Cairo (and probably will depend on it in the future), so I think > >it won't take a whole lot to add the DirectFB glue that is needed. > > > >The best place for the Debian folks to go is fltk.org and post to > >the fltk.development forum. I personally am too busy right now to > >do anything with FLTK... :( > > Hi > > I know a little about FLTK as, while developing the GTK frontend to the > debian-installer, i also investigated about using FLTK+KDrive instead of > GTK+DFB (i eventually preferred GTKDFB as the d-i components are written > in plain ANSI C and some GTK code and GTKDFB packages already existed). > Unfortunately, i don't know FLTK or DFB well enough to write a DFB > backend: anyway, cairo has a DFB backend, written by the actual > maintainer of GTK's DFB backend, Mike Emmel. > My interest for Dillo being ported to GTK+ is that the d-i has to be > kept as small as possible (currently the miniiso is ~9 megs, including > intl fonts) and apps inside it should need no unmet dependencies (and > dillo depends on GTK only, which is already packaged in its DFB version). > Yesterday i started porting Dillo to GTK+ but it seems now clear to me > that dillo is definitely moving away from GTK in favour of FLTK and > there is no going back, right? Right, but the overhead of statically linking FLTK2 is near 300KB. Not a show stopper at all. > So, i guess it makes little sense porting Dillo to GTK+, as this would > only generate, in the best case just an non-mainline fork used in the > d-i only, right? :( Right. Really, the statically linked FLTK2 binary is a good solution. Note: Michael was kind enough to answer me quickly, but please don't CC' him as he has no time currently to work on this. Bill and Dejan are in the FLTK devel forum. -- Cheers Jorge.-

March 21, 2006

Re: [Dillo-dev] [mike@easysw.com: Re: FLTK2-based Dillo for Debian installer]

by Attilio Fiandrotti

<snip> > Jorge Arellano Cid wrote: > >> Hi Michael, >> >> I just received this request in our mailing list. The keypoint >> is how near/far is FLTK2 from having DirectFB rendering support. >> If some Debian developers help with the task, what's your >> estimation? > > > No work has been done. > > That said, I believe Cairo offers DirectFB support, and FLTK 2 can > use Cairo (and probably will depend on it in the future), so I think > it won't take a whole lot to add the DirectFB glue that is needed. > > The best place for the Debian folks to go is fltk.org and post to > the fltk.development forum. I personally am too busy right now to > do anything with FLTK... :( Hi I know a little about FLTK as, while developing the GTK frontend to the debian-installer, i also investigated about using FLTK+KDrive instead of GTK+DFB (i eventually preferred GTKDFB as the d-i components are written in plain ANSI C and some GTK code and GTKDFB packages already existed). Unfortunately, i don't know FLTK or DFB well enough to write a DFB backend: anyway, cairo has a DFB backend, written by the actual maintainer of GTK's DFB backend, Mike Emmel. My interest for Dillo being ported to GTK+ is that the d-i has to be kept as small as possible (currently the miniiso is ~9 megs, including intl fonts) and apps inside it should need no unmet dependencies (and dillo depends on GTK only, which is already packaged in its DFB version). Yesterday i started porting Dillo to GTK+ but it seems now clear to me that dillo is definitely moving away from GTK in favour of FLTK and there is no going back, right? So, i guess it makes little sense porting Dillo to GTK+, as this would only generate, in the best case just an non-mainline fork used in the d-i only, right? :( friendly Attilio

March 21, 2006

[mike@easysw.com: Re: FLTK2-based Dillo for Debian installer]

by Jorge Arellano Cid

Hi there, A follow-up of FLTK2-based Dillo for Debian installer. -- Cheers Jorge.-

March 21, 2006

Re: [Dillo-dev] Refresh via external signal?

by Bill Gatliff

Jorge: > The idea is similar to that of audio (and I've thought of it >in the past because of support for help systems). > > The idea is to start dillo with a command line switch, let's >say: > > ./dillo -remote > > to let it open a socket using the dpid. That way, an external >program can communicate with Dillo using this socket. > > That sounds like exactly what I need. > Once again, manpower is required to make it. > > Well, with any luck this project will get the green light and then it'll be my job to be your manpower for a while! b.g. -- Bill Gatliff bgat(a)billgatliff.com

March 21, 2006

Re: [Dillo-dev] Audio?

by Bill Gatliff

Jorge Arellano Cid wrote: > Not yet. > > It would be easy though. > > The simplest way is to hand the audio URL/stream to a Dillo >plugin that plays the music. > > Ok. As my project gets farther along, I'll probably want to look into this. But if anyone wants to jump in ahead of me, feel free! :) b.g. -- Bill Gatliff bgat(a)billgatliff.com

March 21, 2006

Re: [Dillo-dev] Progress on porting to FLTK2?

by Jorge Arellano Cid

Hola Diego! On Sun, Mar 19, 2006 at 06:54:00PM +0100, Diego Sáenz wrote: > El Tue, 14 Mar 2006 11:53:13 -0400 > Jorge Arellano Cid <jcid(a)dillo.org> escribio: > > > On Fri, Mar 10, 2006 at 09:49:53AM -0500, Roberto C. Sanchez wrote: > > > Hello, > > > > Hi. > > > > > I became interested in Dillo a while back and even made some small contributions > > > and helped fix some bugs, but I was eventually disuaded by the fact that Dillo > > > uses GTK+. I was happy when I heard that Dillo would be ported to FLTK. Has > > > there been any progress on this? I would like to start contributing again, but > > > I have not seen anything other than a few mailing list posts in the archive and > > > a mention of it on the "Current Plans" page. > > > > The port to FLTK is advancing. Slowly, but advancing. > > > > The main problem is lack of funds -> lack of time. > > > > I can not help with funds, but i can adduce a part of mi time. Good! > [...] > > > > The source tree is still not ready for CVS, and I hope that day > > to come. If we can't find a way to fund the project I'll have no > > other option than to leave the project. > > I want to help, with my limited coding skills, to get the code ready for CVS. > How can i do that? At this point, it is mainly deeply complex matters in Dillo Widget (dw) and FLTK2 interaction, that are in development process (and after that, their related bindings) is what keeps Dillo from CVS. One thing that's independent and that you can help us with is with a preferences file parser. At some point we'll get rid of glib so the parser needs a rewrite. A very simple parser, not as complex as the current. This is roughly: variable=<string-value> pairs and e.g. url=http://foo.bar/here title="Hi there" // Double quoted font_factor=1.2 // let conversion later #<comments> with some spelling error checking. Another one is to replace the g_string_* functions, but I have some code for that. Just need to search my harddisk! ;) -- Cheers Jorge.-

March 21, 2006

Re: [Dillo-dev] Refresh via external signal?

by Jorge Arellano Cid

On Mon, Mar 20, 2006 at 09:19:58PM -0600, Bill Gatliff wrote: > Greetings again! Hi again. > If I have an instance of Dillo already running, is there a way for an > external program to tell it to browse a certain URL? No there isn't yet. > I'm trying to > "drive" Dillo from another application as part of a mobility-impaired > application... The idea is similar to that of audio (and I've thought of it in the past because of support for help systems). The idea is to start dillo with a command line switch, let's say: ./dillo -remote to let it open a socket using the dpid. That way, an external program can communicate with Dillo using this socket. Once again, manpower is required to make it. -- Cheers Jorge.-

March 21, 2006

Re: [Dillo-dev] Audio?

by Jorge Arellano Cid

Hi, On Mon, Mar 20, 2006 at 09:16:10PM -0600, Bill Gatliff wrote: > Greetings! > > > Can Dillo "do audio" for web pages that have it? Not yet. It would be easy though. The simplest way is to hand the audio URL/stream to a Dillo plugin that plays the music. I could do it in short time, but I'm under a pile of work on the funding effort and the FLTK2 port. Please let me know if you want to work on this. -- Cheers Jorge.-

March 21, 2006

Re: [Dillo-dev] Dillo and GTK+

by Jorge Arellano Cid

On Sun, Mar 19, 2006 at 02:25:40PM +0100, Attilio Fiandrotti wrote: > Hi Hi! > Recently the debian-installer, Debian's installation system, went > graphical [1]: a GTK frontend was developed and to keep the instalation > ISO as small as possible, so that runs even on low-mem systems, we > choosed the DirectFrameBuffer [2] GTK backend (that has recently become > part of GTK mainline to replace the old linux-fb). > As the DFB backend allows multiple applications to render on the same > VT, i was investigating about intergrating a web browser into the > debian-installer so that the user is able to browse the installation > manual while installing. Yes, that's a good idea. Even further, I've always thought that Dillo would fit perfectly for a general help/info browser on the desktops (a quick interface that allows for fast browsing, using little memory, with search scripts/dpis bindings on the local fs...). > As we need a very small and non X11-tied browser, dillo looks perfect > for our purpose, but, as dillo is based on GTK 1.x, it's currently not > possible running it on a GTKDFB system. > I was wondering how hard would it be porting Dillo to GTK+, so that we > can use it into our installer? > Also, having dillo running on top of GTKDFB, would make it a very good > solution for embedded applications. The Dillo project is moving away from GTK and finishing the port to FLTK2. This means a much smaller footprint than GTK2. FLTK2 has _planned_ rendering on the framebuffer, so AFAIS the easiest path to having a web browser for the Debian installer is to develop the glue code between FLTK2 rendering and the Direct Framebuffer. As FLTK2 currently renders on several different platforms, the rendering abstraction is well defined so it should be easy to start coding. You must ask Michael or Bill from fltk.org for details. -- Cheers Jorge.-

March 21, 2006

Re: [Dillo-dev] Refresh via external signal?

by Bill Gatliff

Tim: Larson, Timothy E. wrote: >Like, if it were AppleScriptable? That would be cool. > > Or, like, even if I just clicked on a URL in an email... b.g. -- Bill Gatliff bgat(a)billgatliff.com

March 21, 2006