Been testing dillo 2.1 for some time and would like to share my experience. It's really great to see some basic css support (appearance of most if not all websites has improved alot), properly resized images, redirection and basic authentication working now :) Anyway, even dillo improved alot recently there still seems to be some issues. Here are some I've noticed after testing this release for few days: Rendering 1) ubuntu.lt Not sure if it's dillo fault or website's malformed stylesheet, but with default dillo settings some of the lithuanian characters are not displayed. This can be fixed by just adding "* {font-family: serif !important}" to the style.css. Here is a pic with some of the places where letters are missing marked in red: http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/2227/ubuntult.png 2) gmail It's nice that login works now, but with default dillo settings the size of most of the text is 1px. This can be partially fixed by adding font_min_size to dillorc, but it's obviously a dillo bug as this doesn't happen with links-hacked. 3) google What's with the textarea in the top left corner of the page? And just for information: signing out doesn't work because it requires basic javascript support (works with links-hacked). 4) Black on black, white on white... http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42776&start=2660&sid=a5712379bdb845ed64a2dfdca10509ea For some reason black font color is used here and we get black text on black background in some posts (doesn't happen with links-hacked). http://www.acetoneteam.org/ Background color is not set here and if we have "body {background-color: white}" rule in our style.css file, we get white text on white background. 5) http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=6592005 What's with the PINK blocks? If that's more of a "feature" then a bug, can the color be changed by using some css rule? 6) http://www.binaryworld.skynet.lt/DUK.html If we use one link with fragment identifier in the page, all the others are marked as visited too. 7) Authentication Basic authentication does work now, but at first the server displays a message saying "wrong credentials or browser doesn't understand how to supply the credentials" and only then a window pops up asking for the credentials... UI 1) Positioning the tab close button on the top RIGHT corner of the browser isn't a good thing because: a) The distance between the most commonly used buttons and the tab close button is pretty big (especially when widescreen monitors are pretty common nowadays); b) It only allows closing the active tab; I think it would be much better if all tabs had close buttons or at least the button was placed near the last tab. 2) Trivial but... because the setting to enable/disable image loading now is in the wrench menu it is two clicks away instead of one as it used to be in dillo 2.0. Maybe css settings could be left where they are now, but the setting for enabling/disabling images could be moved where it was in dillo 2.0? 3) UPPERCASE letters should be used in the File menu to define keyboard shortcuts, because now L looks like I (Open url... ctrl+l) 4) Don't you think "Are you sure you want to close the browser?" message is pretty annoying? Other: It seems whoever designed the new website theme has no idea what READABILITY means... It looks like someone just used some stupid online color picker, which just picks some similar colors to the one user chooses. The old website looked MUCH MUCH better. Imho, it's a regression... PS: how to install dillo 2.1 claws-mail plugin? -- Brain: an apparatus with which we think we think. - A. Bierce
Hi Tomas, On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 05:12:07PM +0300, Tomas R wrote:
Been testing dillo 2.1 for some time and would like to share my experience.
It's really great to see some basic css support (appearance of most if not all websites has improved alot), properly resized images, redirection and basic authentication working now :)
Anyway, even dillo improved alot recently there still seems to be some issues. Here are some I've noticed after testing this release for few days: Rendering 1) ubuntu.lt Not sure if it's dillo fault or website's malformed stylesheet, but with default dillo settings some of the lithuanian characters are not displayed. This can be fixed by just adding "* {font-family: serif !important}" to the style.css. Here is a pic with some of the places where letters are missing marked in red: http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/2227/ubuntult.png
I guess the problem is that the font simply does not contain those glyphs. There are some rules how this case should be handled, but dillo does not implement them currently.
2) gmail It's nice that login works now, but with default dillo settings the size of most of the text is 1px. This can be partially fixed by adding font_min_size to dillorc, but it's obviously a dillo bug as this doesn't happen with links-hacked.
I don't have a gmail account, so I can't reproduce it, but there seems to be a general bug in the CSS code that makes fonts smaller than in other browsers.
3) google What's with the textarea in the top left corner of the page? And just for information: signing out doesn't work because it requires basic javascript support (works with links-hacked).
That textarea is in the google page. It's just hidden due to a "display: none" CSS directive which is not supported yet by dillo. Actually I'd like to know the reason why it is there before hiding it.
4) Black on black, white on white... http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42776&start=2660&sid=a5712379bdb845ed64a2dfdca10509ea For some reason black font color is used here and we get black text on black background in some posts (doesn't happen with links-hacked).
Oh. This is just horrible HTML / CSS, it's full of bugs! The reason for black on black is: <body bgcolor="#000000" text="#C0C0C0" link="#33CC00" vlink="#33CC00" /> I.e. body is immediately closed. But there is tons of other bugs on this page.
http://www.acetoneteam.org/ Background color is not set here and if we have "body {background-color: white}" rule in our style.css file, we get white text on white background.
dillo does not handle color definitions of the form rgb(255,255,255) yet. I guess we can fix that.
5) http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=6592005 What's with the PINK blocks? If that's more of a "feature" then a bug, can the color be changed by using some css rule?
I can't find pink blocks on that page. Where exactly do you see them? Maybe post a screenshot.
6) http://www.binaryworld.skynet.lt/DUK.html If we use one link with fragment identifier in the page, all the others are marked as visited too.
Not sure how this should be handled correctly. Someone will have to check the specs.
7) Authentication Basic authentication does work now, but at first the server displays a message saying "wrong credentials or browser doesn't understand how to supply the credentials" and only then a window pops up asking for the credentials...
UI 1) Positioning the tab close button on the top RIGHT corner of the browser isn't a good thing because: a) The distance between the most commonly used buttons and the tab close button is pretty big (especially when widescreen monitors are pretty common nowadays); b) It only allows closing the active tab; I think it would be much better if all tabs had close buttons or at least the button was placed near the last tab.
Agreed. Patch welcome :)
2) Trivial but... because the setting to enable/disable image loading now is in the wrench menu it is two clicks away instead of one as it used to be in dillo 2.0. Maybe css settings could be left where they are now, but the setting for enabling/disabling images could be moved where it was in dillo 2.0? 3) UPPERCASE letters should be used in the File menu to define keyboard shortcuts, because now L looks like I (Open url... ctrl+l) 4) Don't you think "Are you sure you want to close the browser?" message is pretty annoying?
Which one exactly? When exiting dillo with multiple tabs/windows open? I don't think dillo asks a lot for confirmation, but I normally use multiple Ctrl-q's to close all tabs and windows and quit.
Other: It seems whoever designed the new website theme has no idea what READABILITY means... It looks like someone just used some stupid online color picker, which just picks some similar colors to the one user chooses. The old website looked MUCH MUCH better. Imho, it's a regression...
Hm I like the new design, but I agree that readability might be a problem. Let's see what other say.
PS: how to install dillo 2.1 claws-mail plugin?
Just install claws and the dillo plugin from source or packages depending on your distribution. Then make sure that dillo-2.1 is the dillo binary in your PATH. Cheers, Johannes
Johannes wrote:
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 05:12:07PM +0300, Tomas R wrote:
1) ubuntu.lt Not sure if it's dillo fault or website's malformed stylesheet, but with default dillo settings some of the lithuanian characters are not displayed. This can be fixed by just adding "* {font-family: serif !important}" to the style.css. Here is a pic with some of the places where letters are missing marked in red: http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/2227/ubuntult.png
I guess the problem is that the font simply does not contain those glyphs. There are some rules how this case should be handled, but dillo does not implement them currently.
Yeah, everything works for me because I have a real shortage of fonts, so 99.9999% of text is shown in DejaVu fonts.
6) http://www.binaryworld.skynet.lt/DUK.html If we use one link with fragment identifier in the page, all the others are marked as visited too.
Not sure how this should be handled correctly. Someone will have to check the specs.
I'm not aware of anything in the HTML spec on it, at least.
3) UPPERCASE letters should be used in the File menu to define keyboard shortcuts, because now L looks like I (Open url... ctrl+l)
I'll look into this.
It seems whoever designed the new website theme has no idea what READABILITY means... It looks like someone just used some stupid online color picker, which just picks some similar colors to the one user chooses. The old website looked MUCH MUCH better. Imho, it's a regression...
Hm I like the new design, but I agree that readability might be a problem. Let's see what other say.
I still find visited text to be hard to read, but I know I should break down and get a new display...
I wrote:
Johannes wrote:
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 05:12:07PM +0300, Tomas R wrote:
3) UPPERCASE letters should be used in the File menu to define keyboard shortcuts, because now L looks like I (Open url... ctrl+l)
I'll look into this.
Hmm, I thought you were saying that this was new behaviour, but I see the old code worked that way as well. You give the shortcut to fltk and it draws it however it wants to draw it. Oh, maybe your UI font used to be a serif font... It is currently hardcoded to use font_sans_serif (the reason being that whatever default UI font fltk picked out for us was reasonably likely to have worse unicode coverage than the fonts we set in dillorc), but there has been talk of adding prefs for UI font and fontsize -- which I'd be willing to do.
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 05:24:28PM +0000, corvid wrote:
Johannes wrote:
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 05:12:07PM +0300, Tomas R wrote:
[...] 6) http://www.binaryworld.skynet.lt/DUK.html If we use one link with fragment identifier in the page, all the others are marked as visited too.
Not sure how this should be handled correctly. Someone will have to check the specs.
I'm not aware of anything in the HTML spec on it, at least.
Dillo shows pages already in memory in visited color. That way you can easily tell an in-memory link from one that's yet to be downloaded. This is very useful when switching from online to offline mode (e.g. dialup). IOW those links are rendered as visited because they're cached. In the same page (answers section), unvisited links are rendered as such. -- Cheers Jorge.-
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 06:49:06PM +0200, Johannes Hofmann wrote:
Hi Tomas,
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 05:12:07PM +0300, Tomas R wrote:
Been testing dillo 2.1 for some time and would like to share my experience.
It's really great to see some basic css support (appearance of most if not all websites has improved alot), properly resized images, redirection and basic authentication working now :)
Anyway, even dillo improved alot recently there still seems to be some issues. Here are some I've noticed after testing this release for few days: Rendering 1) ubuntu.lt Not sure if it's dillo fault or website's malformed stylesheet, but with default dillo settings some of the lithuanian characters are not displayed. This can be fixed by just adding "* {font-family: serif !important}" to the style.css. Here is a pic with some of the places where letters are missing marked in red: http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/2227/ubuntult.png
I guess the problem is that the font simply does not contain those glyphs. There are some rules how this case should be handled, but dillo does not implement them currently.
I see.
2) gmail It's nice that login works now, but with default dillo settings the size of most of the text is 1px. This can be partially fixed by adding font_min_size to dillorc, but it's obviously a dillo bug as this doesn't happen with links-hacked.
I don't have a gmail account, so I can't reproduce it, but there seems to be a general bug in the CSS code that makes fonts smaller than in other browsers.
The account is just few clicks away ;)
3) google What's with the textarea in the top left corner of the page? And just for information: signing out doesn't work because it requires basic javascript support (works with links-hacked).
That textarea is in the google page. It's just hidden due to a "display: none" CSS directive which is not supported yet by dillo. Actually I'd like to know the reason why it is there before hiding it.
I guess, that's a honeypot for spambots.
4) Black on black, white on white... http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42776&start=2660&sid=a5712379bdb845ed64a2dfdca10509ea For some reason black font color is used here and we get black text on black background in some posts (doesn't happen with links-hacked).
Oh. This is just horrible HTML / CSS, it's full of bugs! The reason for black on black is: <body bgcolor="#000000" text="#C0C0C0" link="#33CC00" vlink="#33CC00" />
I.e. body is immediately closed. But there is tons of other bugs on this page.
I see. I'll try to contact the admin and see if I can fix some of the bugs.
http://www.acetoneteam.org/ Background color is not set here and if we have "body {background-color: white}" rule in our style.css file, we get white text on white background.
dillo does not handle color definitions of the form rgb(255,255,255) yet. I guess we can fix that.
Sounds good :)
5) http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=6592005 What's with the PINK blocks? If that's more of a "feature" then a bug, can the color be changed by using some css rule?
I can't find pink blocks on that page. Where exactly do you see them? Maybe post a screenshot.
Sure. Some of the blocks marked in red: http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/2749/ubuntuforums.png http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6066/ubuntuforums1.png
6) http://www.binaryworld.skynet.lt/DUK.html If we use one link with fragment identifier in the page, all the others are marked as visited too.
Not sure how this should be handled correctly. Someone will have to check the specs.
I've checked opera, firefox, midori and chromium (aka google chrome under BSD license) browsers. None of them act like that.
7) Authentication Basic authentication does work now, but at first the server displays a message saying "wrong credentials or browser doesn't understand how to supply the credentials" and only then a window pops up asking for the credentials...
UI 1) Positioning the tab close button on the top RIGHT corner of the browser isn't a good thing because: a) The distance between the most commonly used buttons and the tab close button is pretty big (especially when widescreen monitors are pretty common nowadays); b) It only allows closing the active tab; I think it would be much better if all tabs had close buttons or at least the button was placed near the last tab.
Agreed. Patch welcome :)
2) Trivial but... because the setting to enable/disable image loading now is in the wrench menu it is two clicks away instead of one as it used to be in dillo 2.0. Maybe css settings could be left where they are now, but the setting for enabling/disabling images could be moved where it was in dillo 2.0? 3) UPPERCASE letters should be used in the File menu to define keyboard shortcuts, because now L looks like I (Open url... ctrl+l) 4) Don't you think "Are you sure you want to close the browser?" message is pretty annoying?
Which one exactly? When exiting dillo with multiple tabs/windows open? I don't think dillo asks a lot for confirmation, but I normally use multiple Ctrl-q's to close all tabs and windows and quit.
Yup, the one with multiple tabs. I just use my WM's shortcut for closing the window.
Other: It seems whoever designed the new website theme has no idea what READABILITY means... It looks like someone just used some stupid online color picker, which just picks some similar colors to the one user chooses. The old website looked MUCH MUCH better. Imho, it's a regression...
Hm I like the new design, but I agree that readability might be a problem. Let's see what other say.
PS: how to install dillo 2.1 claws-mail plugin?
Just install claws and the dillo plugin from source or packages depending on your distribution. Then make sure that dillo-2.1 is the dillo binary in your PATH.
Ok, I'll try.
UI 1) Positioning the tab close button on the top RIGHT corner of the browser isn't a good thing because: a) The distance between the most commonly used buttons and the tab close button is pretty big (especially when widescreen monitors are pretty common nowadays); b) It only allows closing the active tab; I think it would be much better if all tabs had close buttons or at least the button was placed near the last tab.
Agreed. Patch welcome :)
It seems this requires patching fltk -> http://www.mail-archive.com/fltk@easysw.com/msg05658.html
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 10:49:05PM +0300, Tomas Rimkus wrote:
UI 1) Positioning the tab close button on the top RIGHT corner of the browser isn't a good thing because: a) The distance between the most commonly used buttons and the tab close button is pretty big (especially when widescreen monitors are pretty common nowadays); b) It only allows closing the active tab; I think it would be much better if all tabs had close buttons or at least the button was placed near the last tab.
Agreed. Patch welcome :)
It seems this requires patching fltk -> http://www.mail-archive.com/fltk@easysw.com/msg05658.html
This just means, that fltk does not support that out of the box. It would certainly be possible to implement it in dillo by overriding the default fltk tab drawing code. Cheers, Johannes
One more thing that I forgot to mention in the first message is text wrapping in textareas. By default unlike all the popular browsers dillo does not wrap text in textareas. Actually discussion about this was started in this mailing list some time ago but unexpectedly finished after corvid pointed out that according to the standards it's up to the browser to decide whether to wrap text or not. Maybe, if someone thinks it's better when text is not wrapped, this could be made optional? Would it be easy to implement this setting with fltk?
On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 05:12:07PM +0300, Tomas R wrote:
Been testing dillo 2.1 for some time and would like to share my experience.
It's really great to see some basic css support (appearance of most if not all websites has improved alot), properly resized images, redirection and basic authentication working now :)
Anyway, even dillo improved alot recently there still seems to be some issues. Here are some I've noticed after testing this release for few days: Rendering 1) ubuntu.lt Not sure if it's dillo fault or website's malformed stylesheet, but with default dillo settings some of the lithuanian characters are not displayed. This can be fixed by just adding "* {font-family: serif !important}" to the style.css. Here is a pic with some of the places where letters are missing marked in red: http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/2227/ubuntult.png 2) gmail It's nice that login works now, but with default dillo settings the size of most of the text is 1px. This can be partially fixed by adding font_min_size to dillorc, but it's obviously a dillo bug as this doesn't happen with links-hacked. 3) google What's with the textarea in the top left corner of the page? And just for information: signing out doesn't work because it requires basic javascript support (works with links-hacked). 4) Black on black, white on white... http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42776&start=2660&sid=a5712379bdb845ed64a2dfdca10509ea For some reason black font color is used here and we get black text on black background in some posts (doesn't happen with links-hacked). http://www.acetoneteam.org/ Background color is not set here and if we have "body {background-color: white}" rule in our style.css file, we get white text on white background.
hg tip now has support for color definitions of the form rgb(255,255,255). Please give it a try. Cheers, Johannes
On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 14:24:41 +0200 Johannes Hofmann <Johannes.Hofmann@gmx.de> wrote:
hg tip now has support for color definitions of the form rgb(255,255,255).
Please give it a try.
Thanks. It seems to work ok. I have also tried the patch which makes text wrapping work in textareas ( http://lists.auriga.wearlab.de/pipermail/dillo-dev/2009-April/006267.html ). The text does wrap but it doesn't automatically scroll down. Maybe the patch could be committed with some adjustments? -- Brain: an apparatus with which we think we think. - A. Bierce
participants (4)
-
corvid＠lavabit.com -
jcid＠dillo.org -
Johannes.Hofmann＠gmx.de -
sandshrew＠gmail.com